Episode 317: The Crisis of Dirk Diamond

[00:00:27] Speaker A: Welcome to the mysterious old Radio Listening Society, a podcast dedicated to suspense, crime, and horror stories from the golden age of radio. I'm Eric. [00:00:36] Speaker B: I'm Tim. [00:00:36] Speaker C: And I'm Joshua. [00:00:37] Speaker D: We love mysterious old time radio stories, but do they stand the test of time? That's what we're here to find out. [00:00:43] Speaker C: Today, we return to the Listener library for a recommendation from our mysterious listener, Hank, an episode of Suspense entitled the Crisis of Dirk Diamond. [00:00:55] Speaker A: Hank specifically tailored the suggestion to Tim's idiosyncratic taste, describing the production as a trippy later episode of Suspense that might appeal to Tim's appreciation of the unconventional and resonate with his insider's take on the creative process. [00:01:12] Speaker D: Suspense premiered on CBS in 1942 and remained on the air for the next 20 years. Known for its a list stars, high production values, and sophisticated scripts, Suspense raised the bar for dramatic radio. By the early 1950s, though, suspense began to struggle with his shrinking listenership. Thanks to competition from television and the departure of longtime sponsor Autolite. [00:01:32] Speaker C: The tight budget meant producers often relied on recycled scripts, some from the earlier days of suspense, others borrowed from programs like Escape and the Mysterious Traveler. The crisis of Dirk diamond came to suspense by a more circuitous route. The script was adapted from an episode of the 1951 CBS television anthology series the Web. The radio version is credited to Sam Locke, a journeyman writer who worked in radio, television, film, and theater. It is unclear if Locke was responsible for the original television script or merely retooled it for suspense. [00:02:10] Speaker A: And now let's listen to the crisis of Dirk diamond from suspense. First aired October 18, 1959. [00:02:18] Speaker D: It's late at night, and a chill has set in. You're alone and the only light you see is coming from an antique radio. Listen to the sounds coming from the speaker. Listen to the music and listen to the voices. [00:02:31] Speaker B: Another tale well calculated to keep you in suspense. In each of us, there is a possible murderer. Or a man who feeds on murder. Revels in the sound of it, the thrill of it. This is the story of a man who murdered for the pleasure of others. The story of Dirk diamond, written by Sam Locke. As far as I can see, we don't need the doctor anymore. Done a pretty good job for us so far. We're in confidence. We meet twice a month at night. That's Welby talking. Robert Welby of the syndicate. He okays the murders. No, gentlemen, I think we've got to get rid of the doctor. You're right, Bob. 100% their vice president. Nobody see. We see eye to eye on that. I had a feeling we would me? I'm the guy who does the murdering. So it's settled. The doctor must go, right? Get rid of. No, no, I don't see why we should. He's outlived his usefulness, Mike. Give him a chance. We can't take chances, Mike. Not with Dirk diamond, not right now. What do you mean, not right now? He means that things are not so good with Dirk diamond right now. So I'm afraid you'll have to kill the doctor. All right, when? Oh, I'd like to see it in the papers in about six weeks. And no blood this time? Yeah, that's right. The last three have been too messy. No blood. Well, it's not going to be easy. The murders are coming too quick. No, Mike, they're not coming quick enough. Murder is what the public expects from Dirk diamond. And if you don't give the public what it expects, they stop reading Dirk diamond and go to other comic strips. They're doing that already. George. Show Bob the cancellations. Kim, in this week, the Pittman chain, ten newspapers all together. All right, so what? So what? A couple of lousy cancellations. You act like Dirk diamond is finished. Ten years it's been the top comic strip. All right, now the meeting is over. You wait, Mike. Okay? Can I drop you, George? I got some work to clean up and then I'll go. All right, Mr. Welby, get it over with. Dirk diamond stinks. Go ahead, Mike. Why do you think the strip is going downhill? If I knew that, we wouldn't be here. Oh, look, diamond is as good as he ever was. Mike, people don't read a comic strip like yours for the hero, it's the villains. But I've given him plenty of villains. Needle nose and mosquito and armless Eve and midget mouth and a hundred others. Now, it doesn't matter how monstrous I make them, they just don't go. I don't understand. Well, it's simple, Mike. This is the age of the h palm of rockets to outer space of science fiction. What you sell is fear, Mike. Monstrosity isn't frightening anymore. Alright, so what am I supposed to do? Find a fresh approach to fear. How? What are you afraid of? What's that going to do? Answer my question. What are you afraid of? You. What? Well, you ask me. I'm telling you I'm afraid of you. Everybody in the synagogue. Let's not degenerate this into a discussion of personal relationships. Stick to the subject. What have you always been afraid of? Before you met me? No, of being poor. I guess that's a worry. Mike, what frightens you? What really frightens you? Death. Every fright is a fear of death. But what reminds you most of death? What in your entire life has you been more afraid of than anything? Freddy. Freddy? Freddy who? I don't know. I made him up for the strip. The strip? No, this is a long time ago, when I was just four years old. You see, one time I was afraid to sleep alone, but I needed an excuse to call my mother. So I thought, if I can just make up something that will brighten me enough to scream, then my mother will have to stay with me. And that's how you made up Freddie? It didn't seem like I was making him know. He just stepped right into my mind and started walking toward me, full of murder. And I screamed, all right. My mother came. After that, whenever I wanted her, I would just think of Freddie and scream. But then one night, I started to think of Freddie when I didn't want to. In the dark, I suddenly seemed to seem giggling, you know, coming closer, his hands out to kill me. And I'd try to keep him screaming, but I'd scream. What did he look like? Well, he had a very soft face. And he laughed in a kind of a high giggle. And he was very blonde, almost an albino. And he was so heavy. He walked like a fat woman on high heels. And his arms were short, and his hands, they were always sweaty. That's it. I even like the name Freddy. That is the next villain. Mike, wait a minute. No, I'm not going to do that. Look, please. I don't want to get started with Freddy. I suppose you think crazy. No, I understand. You're still susceptible to your childhood fear. Yes, that's it. You're afraid of Freddy. Good. But you also told me that you were afraid of me. And that's much more reasonable, old man, because Freddy only exists in your imagination. But me, I'm right here. And in our ten years together, you've seen what's happened when I'm crossed, haven't you? Yes, I have seen. Now, who are you more afraid of, Michael, old man? Freddy or me? I'll have the first batch in two weeks. Good boy. Frankly, Mike, Freddy is the only thing that can save Dirk diamond for you. What's funny? Ask me. You didn't ask me how I saved myself from Freddie. Go on. Well, every time I think of Freddy coming to kill me, I just make up another man who would fight Freddy off for me. And then I was safe. You know what his name was? Dirk Diamond. I made up Dirk diamond to save me from Freddy. And now Freddy is going to save Dirk diamond and me. In just a moment, we will return for the second act of suspense. And now, here's a message from the watchmakers of Switzerland. Swiss vacation. Win a fabulous vacation for two in beautiful Switzerland. Enter the swiss vacation contest. It's easy. Nothing to buy. Pick up a free entry blank at a jewelry store or other store that sells quality watches. Then, in 25 words or less, complete this statement. A quality watch is the best value because there are 1000 prizes. First prize, a 21 day vacation for two in Switzerland. You fly deluxe swiss air both ways. Visit many colorful places. All expenses paid for two people, plus $500 extra spending money. 2nd, third and fourth prizes. 15 day swiss vacations for two. Also, four mink stoves, eight bolex movie cameras and projectors. Twelve Hermes typewriters, 100 and $6000 watches. 812 gala assortments of Tobler swiss chocolates. Enter the swiss vacation contest today. Free entry blanks at your jewelry store. Mike, we just signed the Higgs McCoy chain. 14 newspapers. That makes 30 papers this month alone. We've got a lot to thank Freddie for. Yeah, a lot. The last two months of the strip have been wonderful. What's gotten into Freddy? What? Oh, nothing, Mr. Welby. Goodbye. It's not nothing. Everything goes so easily. The panels, the storyline, even the dialogue. And I don't quite understand. Not for a long time. Then one day, my assistant comes into my office with a strip of my drawings. Mike, something's wrong. What? What's wrong? Well, in this panel, you told me you were going to draw Freddy looking frightened. Yes, that's right. Well, you have him smiling. What? Let me see. Oh, yeah. You want to change it before I ink it? No, just let me have your eraser there. Mikey's still smiling. Yeah, let me have your eraser again. Funny, it still looks kind of like a. Yeah, yeah, he's still smiling, isn't he? Well, do you want him looking frightened? It doesn't matter what I want. You see, it's what he wants. I have to do what he wants. Mikey, you all right? Sure you ain't get in. That's all. Go on, he get in. Okay. Hello? Get me Mr. Welby. Well, find him. It's a matter of life and death. Understand? It's life or death. I have to murder Freddie. Within 30 days, you'll be dead. It'll have to be big. Otherwise Mr. Welby wouldn't go for it. No. Two for a nickel. Ideas for him. I walk through the entire apartment back and forth past all the gifts and the meadows and trophies I've been given by Dirk diamond fan Club from New Jersey to Hong Kong. Clocks and statuettes and loving cups and ashtrays. And the music box in my bedroom with a stiletto encased in it. When the stiletto was taken out of its scabbard, the music box plays and when it's put back, it stops. Ingenious construction. And that's what I need now. I need ingenious construction because I've got to kill him. Just kill him. Operator. Operator, what time is it? 05:45 a.m. Do you wish to place a call? Yeah, Western Union. Thank you. Western Union. Western Union. This is Mike Snyder. Barton Hotel would like you to pick up a package at the desk and deliver it to the well be syndicate. Yes, Mrs. Snyder. And you tell the messenger to be very careful with a package. Yes, Mrs. Snyder. Because there's a body in it. Yes, Mr. What? It's a joke. It's all just a joke. I can sleep now. Oh man. I feel like I've had chain struck from my arms and legs. I feel so light. I feel good. I'm happy. Tired. Oh boy. What's that? I put that stiletto back. It shouldn't be. It shouldn't be playing like that. Unless. Unless. Hello, Michael. No surprise. It's a nightmare, that's all. It's a nightmare. A nightmare. This is a fine stiletto, Michael. This is the one you used to kill Mrs. Blue teeth, isn't it? This is a dream. Yes, Mrs. Blue teeth. It's carved on the blade. A copy of the stiletto used by Dirk diamond in killing Mrs. Blue teeth, presented admiringly by the Dirk Diamond Club of Toronto. I like this stiletto, Michael. I admire it. You can't eat tonightmare. So you're giving me 30 more days to live. Don't come any closer. I'm giving you only one day. You put that stiletto down and then there isn't going to be any more. Michael Snyder. It's a nightmare. This is all happening in my brain. Exactly. Even this stiletto in your brain. Now I'm putting it back there. Point first. Oh, no. Yes. Yes. It was a nightmare. It wasn't. No, it can't be. Where's the light? Where's the light? Where's that Solana? It's still there. Quivering. It's quivering in the headboard of a. Look, Mr. Snyder, I took enough with them. Fingerprints in the laboratory. But the fingerprints aren't on file here. So the lab's wiring Washington special for you, Mr. Snyder. FBI. You know, that's a natural. When will they get word back? Oh, any minute. Say, you know, Mr. Snyder, it's funny I should run into you here at the police on know. I got four boys at home who keep talking about nothing. But how is Dirk diamond going to get out of this trap? Freddie's got him in. Can you tell me now how are you going to get him out of this trap? I don't know. I don't. Mulligan. Mr. Snyder, it's the lab. They got word back? Yes. They're the fingerprints of Michael Snyder. I'm not into anybody, Miss Bennett. Mike Snyder. We'll put him on. Mike, where have you been all morning? We've been calling. What? Your train leaves in two minutes. Where are you going? What do you mean? Anywhere. No, I'm not out of my mind. I've got to get away before it's too late. No, I can't explain. No time. Now look, I sent you 30 days of Dirk diamond this morning and you're not using them. If that's the best you can do, Freddie stays alive. You understand? Mike, I never questioned your judgment before. But this time I'm telling you now. You put those strips through because Freddy's got to die. It's him or me. It's him or me. In a moment, we will return for the third act of suspense. Here's Hollywood star Mona Freeman, who feels like acting with a miserable cold. I relieved cold distress the fast way with four way cold tablets. Yes. Tests of all the leading cold tablets proved four way fastest acting. Amazing. Four way starts in minutes to relieve muscular pains and headache. Reduce fever, calm upset stomach. Also overcomes irregularity when a cold strikes. Do what I do. Take four way cold tablets. It's the fast way to relieve nasty cold distress and feel better quickly. Four way. Only twenty nine cents. Our program will continue in a moment after word about another fine product of grove laboratories. Had Dendrif for years. Now get rid of it in three minutes with Fitch dandruff remover shampoo. Three minutes with Fitch regularly is guaranteed to keep unsightly dandruff away forever. Apply Fitch before wetting hair rub in 1 minute. Add water, lather 1 minute, then rinse 1 minute. Every trace of dandruff goes down the drain. Three minutes with Fitch. Embarrassing. Dandruff's gone. Fitch can also leave hair up to 35% brighter. Get Fitch dandruff remover shampoo. Today feels good. Good to hear those wheels. My troubles are being left far behind. And it feels so good to be surrounded by lots of. A man on my right is reading a newspaper, and I can see Dirk diamond. I turn away to the window. That's the first time I've ever turned away from Dirk diamond. And suddenly I know I've turned away from him forever. What did Welby once said? You put a lot of yourself into your comic. Yeah, yeah, I put everything. You know, there's more of me in Dirk diamond, in the risen real life. I have been hiding in a comic strip since I was four years old, hiding from Freddy. But I'm leaving all that behind. Tickets, please. Tickets. I am escaping. I'm free. Tickets, please. I gave you mine before. No, Michael. Oh, sure, Michael, yes. So you don't have your ticket away. Go away. You won't need a ticket, not where you're going. Let go of my. You won't need anything where you're going. She's waking up. Coming out of it. Easy, Mr. You were choking yourself. Your own hands around your neck. It was awful. You have. Fitz. Listen, stop the train. I got to get back. Oh, don't try. Oh, I got to go back. I got to. All right, now, the next stop is Buffalo. You can get off and take a train back. Oh, you shouldn't be moving around. Joe, help him with. No, no, I got to do this myself, all of it myself. I know I promised you a weekend, but this is an emergency. Now, stop whining, will you, Welby Mike. Forget it, Frank. I don't need you. Oh, so you came back. I can't say I'm surprised, not really. Listen, Freddie. Freddie has got to die. Do you understand? Look, it's 03:00 a.m. The entire staff just left, all of us trying to keep dirt diamond going because you go off half calling me up from Grand Central, that you've got to get away. Well, it's not that easy, Mike. Not from me. Mr. Welding. I know Freddie's got to die. I heard you kill him then, but not with this third rate stuff you try to pump off on me this morning. You know where that. But Freddy's the best villain you ever had. You want to get rid of him. It's got to be the best killing you ever had. Otherwise he stays alive. No. All right, start crying then. Start from here. This panel. Dirk has locked himself in his room. And here he's saying, I'm going to kill Freddy. I am going to kill him. That's right. Now, go ahead from there. All right. It's nighttime, Dirk. Lies on a couch, still thinking of his problem. Suddenly, in the night, Freddy appears. From where? I don't know, but he's there with a stiletto. He comes over to the couch and he plunges the knife into Dirk's head. But Dirk awakens and the stiletto stabs into the couch. But you said. First it went into his head. Now, how did he miss? I don't know, but he's missed. There's Freddy, and Dirk grabs him by the. No, no, it's too thin, Mike. Now, look, you might as well face it. You can't kill Freddie off. You're stuck with him for life, I'm afraid. Wait a minute. Now, listen. See, Dirk diamond has never been more frightened in all his life. You see, he knows it's got to be either Freddie or him. There's no other way. Right now, Mike, I want you to go. Dirk remembers something. Then. He first saw Freddie in a dream. Suddenly he realizes nobody else knows Freddie. The only time Dirk's ever seen him, they've been alone together, just him and Freddy. And then it comes to him. Freddy only exists in his mind. See, his most dangerous enemy is a nightmare of his brain. Go on. Now, he knows the one way to get Freddy. Yeah. Dirk diamond will kill himself. Go on. See, he knows Freddy only exists as long as he does. And the only way to bring Freddy into reach is by taking his own throat in his hands and choking. Choking himself. All right, Mike. Stop it. Mike, you're crazy. You see, it worked. It brought buddy into reach. And now he has him by the throat. Using himself as a decoy. He's caught his nightmare. All his nightmares. All the monsters that imprisoned him by the throat. And how it thrills him to feel Freddy's neck between his hands. At last, the mouse playing the cat. Mr. Welby. I'll do a panel of Dirk's face, smiling. Wait. Now, Freddy reaches out for the alarm bell under the desk. And I'll do a strip of this thrashing, desperate hand knocking over the telephone and groping until it reaches the bell under the desk. And with its last dying strength, pushing. And then I'll cut to the bell ringing in the office of the floor watchman and in the lobby. And the local precinct says. And then the floor watchman, he knocks on the door and he calls out. Mr. Welfie. Mr. Welfy. But there's no answer because the monsters are all dead. And Dirk diamond, he's escaped at last. Mr. Welby? Hello. Who are you? Don't you know suspense? You've been listening to the crisis of Dirk diamond, written for suspense by Sam Locke. In a moment, the names of our players and a word about next week's story of suspense. When you listen for news, don't you want it presented in lively fashion by a man you know you can trust? Of course you do. That's why millions listen regularly to Lowell Thomas, whose news broadcasts are on CBS Radio five evenings a week, Monday through Friday. When you want all angles of the news, get them from Lowell Thomas. And when you want all angles on sports, tune in sports time presented every evening except Sunday on CBS Radio. Frank Gifford brings you the high spots and the lowdown on the sports world straight from the horse's mouth. Be in the know on latest news with Lowell Thomas and on sports with sports time, two great services only a network can bring you and only CBS Radio does. Heard in tonight's story were Bernard Grant as Mike, Louis van Rutten as Welby, and Eric Dressler as Freddie. Also included in the cast were Ian Martin, Larry Haynes, and Maurice Tarklin. Listen again next week when we return with another tale well calculated to keep you in suspense on CBS Radio. [00:26:39] Speaker A: That was the crisis of Dirk diamond from suspense, here on mysterious old Radio Listening society Society podcast. Once again, I'm Eric. [00:26:47] Speaker B: I'm Tim. [00:26:47] Speaker C: And I'm Joshua. [00:26:49] Speaker A: And that was brought to us from our listener Hank, who brought that for Tim. It was a present to Tim, thinking Tim would like it. So I think we should probably start right there. First of all, say, thank you, Tim. [00:27:05] Speaker D: Thank you, Tim. No, thank you, Hank. That was very thoughtful. [00:27:09] Speaker A: And his flowery description of what you liked. Did he, first of all, hit the nail on the head with Tim's idiosyncratic tastes? [00:27:20] Speaker D: No argument there. [00:27:21] Speaker C: Yes. [00:27:24] Speaker D: My only sort of critique complaint was, I kind of wish this wasn't a suspense episode. I wish this was mysterious traveler or inner sanctum. It's strange to have this weird, twisty, bizarre story told through the somewhat serious lens of suspense versus the wild, wicked fun of some of these other series. Right. That being said, it's exactly the sort of show that I enjoy, because beat by beat, I'm just going, oh, this is ridiculous. No, this is awesome. Oh, no, this is ridiculous. [00:27:57] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a really interesting take. If you tell me this is inner sanctum or mysterious traveler or whatever, I probably have a different viewpoint of this. Yeah, that's really fascinating because all I could think was, wow, suspense. Just getting a rotator cuff injury, reaching for material. Man. It is. [00:28:19] Speaker C: Hank sent this to the wrong person. I absolutely love this defend it heartily, then go, oh, right now? [00:28:27] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:28:28] Speaker C: You want me to record my thoughts for a podcast? [00:28:31] Speaker D: You could write them down. [00:28:33] Speaker C: I guess I did not get hung up on the suspense style and rate it in that way. I totally see what you're saying, partly because I was aware of this was pretty typical of this era, is to do mysterious traveler type stories or to literally just do mysterious traveler stories for a second or third time. I felt that it was told in these very broad, comic booky style that fit the subject matter from a comic strip artist. And it had me hooked within the first couple of minutes. And that first twist of, these aren't mobsters, they're agents. [00:29:11] Speaker A: Right. [00:29:12] Speaker C: And I was like, okay, this is going to be an interesting episode that is going to play with expectations and on the surface seem like not much is going on other than a pastiche of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde and the comic book industry. But I think underneath, there's a lot going on. I guess I've listened to it as a commentary, which I think is always relevant, the conflict between commercial and creative interests. And it might just be that that has always fascinated me, and I thought it was really well done. Again, I don't want to go in a monologue, but, yeah, it hooked me all the way through. [00:29:54] Speaker A: I think it's interesting that theater of the mind creates a vision in your head for what you're seeing. This is the first time I ever listened to anything that I didn't see it. What I saw was the comic book drawing of this story, as if I was reading an EC comic. I kept seeing the panels of this, which was fascinating because usually I see the people in the room and what they look. The whole thing comes to life for me. I just kept seeing this panel by panel. Drawing by drawing is what kept popping in a minute. Oh, I see the drawing of this. And I thought that was fascinating to me, and it could have been because of the suggestion that the guy draws comics, but nonetheless, the story has a very easy comic kind of feel to. [00:30:39] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah. [00:30:40] Speaker C: And combined with Dick Tracy comic strips, too. With things like sort of needle nose. [00:30:46] Speaker A: Yeah, well, that too. [00:30:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:30:47] Speaker C: Armless eve or blue teeth. [00:30:51] Speaker D: I got to stop for. Before I forget of describing him, it's like he's big, like a fat woman or a fat man. [00:31:00] Speaker B: Right. [00:31:01] Speaker C: He specifically described how he walked, like. [00:31:04] Speaker D: Being on heels, like a fat man. [00:31:07] Speaker C: Fat woman in heels. And if that were the end of that description, I would be like, well, that was just mean. But it's part of a multifaceted description. And I think the goal is to put all these weird attributes together that don't immediately belong together because he also has short arms and sweaty hands and. [00:31:27] Speaker D: A high pitched to get gold. [00:31:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:31:29] Speaker C: And so it's supposed to be off putting in its combination of traits, not in its singularity of. [00:31:35] Speaker D: Also because he was named Freddy, in listening to it, it has this sort of dialogue with nightmare on Elm street. [00:31:42] Speaker A: Yeah, it absolutely does. [00:31:44] Speaker D: Which isn't conscious on either side. So it's hard to really take meaning of it. But it's interesting to draw those parallels of. [00:31:52] Speaker A: I had a thought about that when that entered my head of inspiration comes from everywhere. Right. And who knows the possibility that nightmare on Elm street may have been someone who actually heard this when they were younger. Because it does have that am I in a dream or not? [00:32:09] Speaker D: Craven has talked at length about the source material he drew from. As far as I know, he never mentioned this, but that doesn't mean it's never heard. It didn't seep through his subconscious. [00:32:21] Speaker A: But the similarities are very interesting. [00:32:23] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:32:24] Speaker C: It made me wonder what kind of character Dirk diamond is that he murders all his enemies. Is he a spy? [00:32:32] Speaker B: That was one of the things that. [00:32:33] Speaker D: Jumped out of me is that Dirk diamond is the. He's the character I admitted to protect me. And he's practically invisible in the whole script. He's only there to threaten Freddy. [00:32:43] Speaker A: The Orson. Well, Shadow has killed everybody, but you're. [00:32:48] Speaker C: Talking about just that Dirk diamond is a non entity. [00:32:51] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:32:52] Speaker C: And I think it's brought out in the script because the editor says people don't read comic strips for the heroes, they're here for the villains. [00:33:00] Speaker B: Yes. [00:33:01] Speaker C: Which I thought was really true. [00:33:02] Speaker D: But in the psychology, Dirk diamond just exists so that it is an idea that protects me from Freddy. [00:33:10] Speaker C: And ironically, it's the character that protects him from villains but forces him to do nothing but generate villains to perpetuate him, finally forcing him to bring Freddy into the real world. So I thought some of the psychology for how comic booky it was, was fascinating. [00:33:30] Speaker D: And in execution, in hearing the idea of, like, there is this villain that I have in my mind that we want you to put in this comic strip. And I'm hesitant to do so because of what it means to me psychologically hearing that laid out. Okay. And then in practice, beat by beat, like, oh, this is excellent. [00:33:46] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:33:47] Speaker C: And I think it's interesting, too, that the editor is portrayed really as a good writing partner or a good editor. He keeps pushing him to get to a better story. [00:33:59] Speaker D: I'll go with whatever story you want to tell, just better than this. [00:34:01] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:34:02] Speaker C: What are you afraid of? Death. That's cliche, Farah. Who are you afraid of? You. You should be. But that doesn't make a good story. And it just pushes him until he gets to this really personal dark. It was therapy from his past. Yeah, which again, because of the style and tone that wasn't very suspensey. It surprised me as it kept finding new depths. [00:34:26] Speaker D: My favorite part was, did you mean to draw a smile on Freddy's face and like, oh yeah, erase it and draws it and erases it and draws it. [00:34:34] Speaker A: Which reminded me of that daffy duck cartoon where he keeps getting erased and demanding that the cartoonist draw him better. [00:34:46] Speaker C: I also thought it was interesting from the acknowledge fan clubs, since we're so awash in fandom in our 21st century, and that the fan merchandise was a, weird and b, it was stuff fans made to send to creators instead of creators made for fans to buy. Seems to be the implication, because he goes to this list of gifts from the various fan clubs of clocks, statuettes, loving cups, ashtrays. [00:35:15] Speaker A: I got to stop every time this comes up because we do old time radio stuff and we watch a lot of old. The word loving, it's in wonderful life. The winner of the dance contest will win this loving cup. What in that blazes is a loving cup? It comes up, so cup that adores. [00:35:34] Speaker D: You and will stay with you, supports you. [00:35:37] Speaker C: Very nurturing. I don't know the origin of the term, but it's that classic trophy with the handles on either side and it looks like a gold vase. [00:35:46] Speaker A: Yeah, but why loving? [00:35:47] Speaker D: Because like a good loving partner, it has two handles on the side. [00:35:52] Speaker A: I love you so much. [00:35:56] Speaker D: I do have two handles just on. [00:35:59] Speaker C: The one side, so it's awkward. No bilateral symmetry with Tim. [00:36:06] Speaker B: Oh, yay. [00:36:07] Speaker A: Oh, yay. That's the line from wonderful life. [00:36:09] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:36:09] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. The winner, loving cup. I'm doing wonderful life. [00:36:12] Speaker B: Sorry. All right. [00:36:13] Speaker C: I also like the music box because it made me realize that every time there's a music box in old time radio, you know, for sure, well, this is going to be played again or have some ominous meaning. So it's like Chekhov's music box. [00:36:30] Speaker B: Never. [00:36:30] Speaker C: In radio, if that comes up, it's always going to be important. [00:36:33] Speaker D: When it first came up, they said, and there's a stiletto on the side. I assumed it was some term, like, not an actual stiletto, but just like the pin that you put in a music box to stop it from playing. I don't know that music boxes have that, but no, no, there's a knife in this music box because they say. [00:36:47] Speaker C: It was modeled after the stiletto Dirk used to kill Mrs. Bluetooth. Which, again, he's just like a killer. I was trying to remember, did freudian Dick Tracy, did he kill all his villains? [00:37:02] Speaker A: I think. I mean, because they kept coming back. [00:37:06] Speaker D: But that's also what the EC comics reference totally jumps out of. Like, I'm going to stick this knife in your head. [00:37:12] Speaker B: Right. [00:37:13] Speaker D: That's very easy, comicsy. [00:37:16] Speaker A: Especially that one story, the knife in the head. [00:37:22] Speaker C: I did start to wonder if the stiletto and the brain was combined with the hallucinations he was suffering was a reference to the dagger of the mind Shakespeare stuff. But that might have been me going way into the weeds. [00:37:41] Speaker A: Any chance there's a reference? Maybe not a jab, but just a reference to Richard diamond with the Dirk diamond. It's close, Dick to Richard Dirk. You know what I'm saying? [00:37:52] Speaker C: Especially if he sang a song right before he killed all his enemies. [00:37:56] Speaker A: I'm just wondering if they were a wink of some sort there. Let's say there was and move on. [00:38:03] Speaker D: Absolutely. Wink. [00:38:06] Speaker C: And I just enjoyed the irony of the artist saying there's more of me in Dick diamond than in the world. Is that the quote? [00:38:13] Speaker D: Dirk Diamond. [00:38:14] Speaker B: Dirk diamond. [00:38:15] Speaker C: See, I call him Dick diamond. [00:38:16] Speaker B: Yep. [00:38:16] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a whole other private Dirk. Dick diamond is a whole other series you don't want to watch. Don't google Dick diamond. [00:38:26] Speaker C: That's a lot of carrots. But that idea I've been hiding in a comic book since I was four years old. That's the line that I thought would appeal to Tim because he'd be like, yay, me too. He says, so much of him is in Dirk diamond, but he actually becomes Freddy in the end. Is that the truth of him, that he's always been Freddy? He became the thing he was actually afraid of. I enjoyed that whole final confrontation for so many reasons because, well, one, the writer did a really tricky thing where he just took his entire plot of his own script and pitched it within the script he was actually writing. [00:39:16] Speaker D: I'm finally putting together the moment where he's trying to get. We're going to work through it together. You're going to come up this script that reminded me of dead poet society, when he's like, no, I'm just going to cover your eyes and you're going to make a poem up right here on the spot of like, no, just talk. [00:39:32] Speaker B: Okay? [00:39:33] Speaker D: Where did he come from? What's happening? Like, this is an epic screenplay that is being plotted out here. It's like a three panel comic strip. What's in the first panel wakes up. What's in the second panel? He's scared. What's in the third panel? Cliffhanger. We're done. [00:39:53] Speaker A: You just described 80 years of Mark Trail. [00:39:59] Speaker C: But if you read this as this tension between, again, commercial interests and creative interests, to me, it was fascinating to try to figure out what everybody represented in the end in that final murder scene. I mean, the obvious thing, I think, would be to see the editor as the commercial interest, the agent, and Dick diamond as the creative person. But what is Freddie then? [00:40:26] Speaker D: I mean, to try to chew on that version of it is if Freddie is the commercial desire of, like, Freddie is what the audience wants. We want red meat. And that is that if you want to have something more artistically significant than just, like, watch this guy kill people, you eventually just devolve into, like, watch this guy kill people. [00:40:49] Speaker C: And Freddie is the one who kills that commercial demand. He kills the goose that lays the golden egg. But it's also the goose that craps all over your work. [00:41:01] Speaker A: Six giesalayan. [00:41:04] Speaker C: But if you also think of some of the productive things that the agent did during the story, like in dead poet society, and push Mike to be more creative, to unleash Freddie, well, and. [00:41:17] Speaker D: To know, like, this is what audiences want, this is what will keep you in business. This is what will keep the money flowing. [00:41:24] Speaker C: So in that way, you could read it as, like, unrestrained, uncontrolled creative energy kills all potential for commercial viability. [00:41:34] Speaker A: That's just a fact. [00:41:36] Speaker C: Yeah. Or does it all go back to some freudian thing with Mike's childhood and just wanting to be comforted by his mom? [00:41:44] Speaker D: He just stared into the abyss, and the abyss killed his boss. Yeah. [00:41:48] Speaker C: This is a subconscious drive to kill all other men so you can be alone with your. [00:41:51] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, I think that's. [00:41:54] Speaker A: Oh, we wrap that up. [00:41:57] Speaker C: Like I said, I just thought it had a lot in it, on the surface. Boy, how silly it was. I'm always amazed, enjoyably silly. [00:42:06] Speaker A: I just went, yeah, guy drew a character, came to life. See, I'm so basic. And you just found all of these. [00:42:13] Speaker C: I think it crazy area of interest, that eternal conflict between those. [00:42:20] Speaker A: I don't have any area of interest. [00:42:25] Speaker D: If you were to analyze this in terms of a football game, we'd be lost. Yes. [00:42:30] Speaker A: No, it's not that. I'm just sincerely impressed by how you can find what the intent of the writers might have been. And like I've said before in this podcast, I don't write anything that has layers when I write stuff like, yeah, the guy went to the store. See, it's not like a metaphor for anything. And when you start to talk like this, go, oh, that's super interesting. I wonder if that was the intent. This is more interesting than I thought it was. That's all. It's just a compliment, so take it and shut up. [00:42:59] Speaker C: Fine, I will take it. I think if this were written today, I think Freddie would definitely represent the fandom that destroys both the commercial interests and the creative interests of any project. [00:43:15] Speaker D: Yes, that is probably the most accurate of, do I want to write the story I want to write? Do I want the story you want to write? No, I just want to destroy everything, right? [00:43:24] Speaker C: Burn it all to the ground so. [00:43:27] Speaker D: I'll make it no fun for anyone so that I can be the one who took control of it. I don't even know what I'm saying. [00:43:33] Speaker C: This fandom, like kids today. I love this so much. [00:43:36] Speaker B: I hate it. [00:43:38] Speaker A: What other thoughts do you have, Joshua? How many more layers do we have to go here? Is there more, though? Is there more deeper? This is Russia versus America, 1962. [00:43:53] Speaker D: To go back, sum up my sort of main feeling of it, of, like, if you just did the three sentence description of what is this story? And listed it off to me, I go, well, that sounds stupid. [00:44:05] Speaker C: Yes, I would agree with you. [00:44:08] Speaker D: And so in execution, I'm very impressed of, like, this is not stupid. [00:44:16] Speaker A: That's a new category. [00:44:17] Speaker B: Wow. Sorry. [00:44:18] Speaker A: Classic stands dust time. Not stupid. [00:44:23] Speaker D: But it's fun. [00:44:26] Speaker C: It remains fun and bouncy and kind of jaunty in pace at the same time and does provide a couple good scares. I think the weird, giggling freddy is unsettling. There's a great moment where the production allows you, as the listener to recognize that the person on the train, the conductor, or the person taking tickets is Freddie before Mike does. [00:44:51] Speaker A: Right. [00:44:51] Speaker C: Just a lot of little nice touches. It just shows that there was still a little life left in suspense here at the bitter end. [00:44:59] Speaker A: By life, you mean effort. [00:45:01] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. [00:45:03] Speaker A: Want to vote? You're present. You vote. [00:45:07] Speaker D: Wow. Well, thank you so much. You have your finger on my pulse. [00:45:13] Speaker C: So gross. [00:45:14] Speaker A: Gross. [00:45:17] Speaker D: It's super fun. I very much enjoyed it. Classic might be a strong word, but does stand the test of time. Clearly that we've got a lot to say about it. It can still deliver a scare despite its summation being stupid. [00:45:33] Speaker A: Here's my assessment. Of this before our conversation. I liked it. Right, coming into this. Yeah, I liked it. Stand the test time. Yeah, I think it does. And that's about as far as I'll go with it. Yeah, that was pretty well acted and trophy, and nothing about it was particularly, wow, cool or groundbreaking or anything, but I liked it. I didn't hate it. I enjoyed it after this conversation. I think it's better than that. I think that I like it even better now. But I will stick with I like it. It's pretty good. Stands test of time. [00:46:11] Speaker D: That's one of the things with its little dialogue in my head between it and Freddy Krueger is particularly in the west craven's new nightmare. Sorry, I'm digging in the west craven weeds here, but this idea of this is a creature that thrives on fear. The more you think about it, the more you fear it, the stronger it gets. [00:46:31] Speaker A: Just had this image of Wes Craven going out his front door and telling you to get the hell out of his weeds. [00:46:38] Speaker D: I'm a person under his stairs. Wes Craven jokes. [00:46:45] Speaker C: Well, yeah. Like I said, I think this uncomfortable idea that art is something that must react to supply and demand as a commodity is something we still struggle with today. And how this story captures that struggle really fascinated me. And it was made more poignant to me that it was a radio production done during the dying days of a medium that itself was struggling with creativity versus commercial needs, trying to find a. [00:47:21] Speaker D: Way to kill in a spectacular, big, pressive way. Yeah, he killed a guy, but it was kind of me. [00:47:29] Speaker C: What's the name of the last episode of suspense? [00:47:31] Speaker A: Yeah, it is. [00:47:31] Speaker C: The devil stone. [00:47:32] Speaker A: Yeah, devil something. [00:47:33] Speaker D: Yeah, the devil's may. [00:47:35] Speaker C: Yeah, the devil's may. It did not take its own advice. That was not a spectacular, well structured death scene for suspense. But, yeah, personally, for me, I think this is a late era classic of suspense. It's one of my favorites from these last few years. It's 1959, right? Yeah, it's really close. [00:47:53] Speaker D: There's coming down to the wire. [00:47:54] Speaker C: There's a lot of life left in this old thing at this point. So, yeah, I loved it. Okay, fine. [00:48:02] Speaker A: Good. [00:48:03] Speaker C: Stop complimenting me. [00:48:08] Speaker A: Tim. Tell him stuff. [00:48:09] Speaker D: Hey, please visit ghoulishdelights.com if you have the hankering to do so. You'll find more episodes of the podcast there, although you can listen to those anywhere. You listen to podcasts, [email protected]. You can leave comments on them and vote in polls. Let us know what you think. Let the world know what you think about these episodes. The world needs to know. The world is able to know. You can also link to our social media pages. You can get some swag in our threadless store. You can also click and join our Patreon page to support us through Patreon. [00:48:43] Speaker C: Yes, go to patreon.com. The morals because, guys, I think this was our last listener request that we're taking from the general public. Speaking of creative commercial interests, Patreon supports this podcast, and we have decided one of the perks we are going to give the high tier members of Patreon is that they will be the exclusive givers of recommendations. So if you would like to hear your recommendation on this podcast, pay us. I was going to state it more eloquently than that. You can go to patreon.com, slash them. [00:49:22] Speaker D: And offers remittance in exchange for this service. [00:49:26] Speaker C: We're whores. [00:49:28] Speaker D: Unrelated but true. [00:49:30] Speaker A: I just realized that I don't know what Wes Craven looks like, and every time I hear the name Wes Craven, I picture he looks like Freddie from that's what I think Wes Craven actually looks like Freddie. I know that's not true, but. [00:49:43] Speaker D: Not true. [00:49:44] Speaker A: But what if. What does he look like? [00:49:47] Speaker D: I mean, he passed away, but so not great now, but maybe like Freddie now. But when he was alive, he was kind of any guy with a beard. Okay, imagine me with more hair. [00:50:00] Speaker C: If you were a Patreon member, you would have received this podcast with this conversation edited out. So that's another perk if you'd like. [00:50:10] Speaker A: To see us performing live. The mysterious old radio listening Society is also a theater company that produces and performs classic old time radio theater and a lot of its own original radio drama, audio drama live on stage. So if you'd like to see us perform, we've been performing for close to seven years, every month, somewhere. All you got to do is go to ghoulishdelights.com and you'll see where we're performing and what we're performing this month. And then you can come see us. There's a link to tickets and everything. If you can't, for whatever reason, come see us live by being a Patreon. We film them, and you get that as part of your Patreon perk, you get to watch those shows as we post them online. What are we doing next? [00:50:52] Speaker C: Next is your recommendation, Eric. [00:50:54] Speaker A: Oh, we're going to do that. Candy Matson. [00:50:57] Speaker B: See? [00:50:58] Speaker A: Is that right? [00:50:59] Speaker B: That's right. [00:50:59] Speaker A: We're actually going to. Nice. I'm good. We're doing Jack Frost for the holidays from Candy Matson. Until then, Kellogg. [00:51:14] Speaker B: Kellogg's pep. The build up wheat cereal, with the prize in every package, invites you to share another thrilling adventure with Mark trails. [00:51:24] Speaker D: What's in the first panel? Wakes up. What's in the second panel? He's scared. What's in the third panel? Cliffhanger. We're done. [00:51:30] Speaker B: Tune in same time, same station on Monday and find out what happens to mark trail.